By Morten Greis Greis Games B/X Levels 5-7
In a mysterious cave, darkness whispers secrets to those who dare to listen, and daring adventurers can win divinations and learn the magical secrets of Dark Magicians, but not everyone escapes alive from the Troll Pit, where darkness consumes the careless.
This 24 page adventure uses eight pages to describe thirteen rooms, most of which are in an underground cave. It’s got a nice premise, but doesn’t explore its themes enough, and the individual room entries, from read-aloud to DM text, overstay their welcome. I don’t need a theme, unless you tell me there is one. 🙂
Ok, so, a lot of lame-o hooks about bandits, goblins, apprentices and so on. They all suck and can fuck right off. What IS good is the core premise: inside a cave system in a bog/swamp is a great chasm, a bottomless abyss. And if you listen hard enough, it will whisper secrets to you … Fuck yeah man! SIGN MY ASS UP! This is a good thing. Oracular visions. Places of power. Loot. These are the things that drive a PLAYERS soul. Well, the things that are easy anyway. Other emotions may serve better, but are substantially harder to accomplish. Re: Making the PLAYERS revile the villain … through non-odious/non-fiat means. So, yeah man, “You can become a Dark Magician if you stand by the abyss in the depths of trolls and let an Abyssal Fly take up residence in your body” Uh huh! In the depths of the trolls? Stand on the abyss? LET AN ABYSSAL FLY TAKE UP RESIDENCE?! I got visa’s in my name bitch! Take my money!
There’s are things here that speak to your soul. A crow suddenly taking flight. Goblins, “The goblins can smell the adventurers, and the adventurers can hear the goblins talk about being able to smell people.” YES! That’s the fucking way a goblin works! A scream in the dark on the wandering table. The rays of dawn striking a statue though a hole in the roof, causing a hole in the wall to appear for one hour, revealing a treasure! Or, the mists, rolling in the caves after dark, obscuring things. There are parts here that are just RIGHT. They make sense, in every definition of the words. The context in to which the adventure falls FEELS right. And the rumors! “Two drunk people compete to talk about how dangerous the caves are. Goblins abound! There are lots of them and they eat people raw and preferably alive! It is best to go there during the day when they sleep!” Fun! Interesting! Or perhaps, you’ve been listening to those whispers from the abyss, trying to learn a secret, like “Dire Words of a fateful moment: The character receives a warning of a deadly trap. The next time a trap kills the character, the character is reminded of the words and the deadly effect of the trap is avoided (depending on the type of trap, the character fails to step in, activate, or be exposed to the trap; avoid interacting with or activating the trap).”
But, alas, the promise is not fulfilled.
Our read-aloud is long. VERY long. And thus will not be paid attention to. And it over reveals. Instead of simplifying saying a towering statue it must go on and describe the statue … which leads to the long read-aloud. These things, the details, should be saved for the back and forth between player and DM that is the heart of the D&D experience. And this happens time and time again. In the read-aloud, or, in the DM text. Yes, you could, potentially, make them long. But only f you’ve dona lot of work to make it very scannable and usable at he table. ANd that is a heroes effort seldom found. And not here. Instead, maybe, don’t over describe in the read-aloud. A tower statue stretching to the ceiling will do. THEN tell the DM what is going on so they can relate it to the players when, hopefully, the fuckwits ask about it.
And, the adventure has this whole Troll Pit thing going on. IDK what that is. Maybe it’s lost in translation or has some cultural context I’m missing? There IS a troll down there. A troll king, a corrupted human. Who basically talks to you. (And the adventure notes that, at 8HD, if too much for the party to handle? This is a level 5-7 adventure, right?) Anyway, the whole Troll Pit thing is not really present and doesn’t come across very well. And, for that matter, neither does the whispers in the darkness, though that manages things better than the troll pit thing does. There a crazy lady in one room, a dude in another who exists only as a whisper, and the core abyss whisper mechanic, with you going deeper and more precarious to get a better listen roll, works well. Still, it all FEELS lightly themed. Perhaps because of the length of the thing? It’s just not FANTASTIC, although it does lean that way with the crazy lady, abyss, voice in the darkness, and that statue. Maybe even the troll king thing, but it’s out of place here.
And for all that there’s a lot missing. Confusion about the entrances. Read-aloud that is a little too flowery “Only reluctantly it gives way to your light.” Uh uh. Or descriptions in the text that don’t match up to the map very well, not communicating things well.
So, it’s not a disaster, but, also, it’s not a home run either. I think, perhaps, if the theming were stronger or the text a little more organized/shorter/better I might have bumped this in to No Regerts. But, as is, there’s jts too much for me to handle.
This is $3 at DriveThru. The preview is six pages. You get to see those rumors, as well as several encounter descriptions. So, it does give a feel for how the writing is.
https://www.drivethrurpg.com/product/390975/Troll-Pit–A-B-X-adventure?1892600
It is stated that the adventure is for a party of (B/X) levels 2 to 4, or a single level 5 to 7 character. Therefore the Troll King might wipe them out.
I never understood challenge ratings, but 4 level 4 characters should handle a single 8 hd troll, right? -3llense’g
OSR doesn’t use challenge ratings
Depending on the system even 4 4HD PCs are likely to suffer at least one death in such a scenario, more likely two
Which is fine: It all depends on the size of the party. Old-timey adventures made it clear of not only the PC levels but also how large the party is expected to be. A party of 6-8 PCs against 1 8 HD non-spellcasting/non-poisonous monster is not terrible odds, although there will be casualties in a toe-to-toe fight, which is to be avoided in an old-timey mindset.
No, four fourth level characters would probably be killed by an 8HD troll. I can speak to this after watching a group of exactly that composition get wrecked by a lone standard troll. Remember that these things get three attacks per round at THACO 13, and fourth level characters don’t have fireball. My players lost one PC in the first round and promptly beat a hasty retreat after almost losing another in the second round. If they don’t get lucky with some good rolls in the first couple rounds, it’s a downward spiral of pain.
Maybe with magic armor and shields, some +1 weapons, and the thief getting in a backstab it is just about doable but I wouldn’t take any bets. I can see casting Light on the troll to blind it but otherwise there is little recourse in the spell selection, 3 attacks per round, 8 HD and regeneration is very hard to overcome.
Long-term DM here: One tough baddy, especially one without a ranged attack or spells, against an entire party is often a design flaw. A 4th level magic-user, for example, has access to *web,* a 4th level cleric has *hold person,* both of which tend to quickly end an engagement against a sole target. That’s part of the reason for the Gygaxian insistence of sub-chiefs and “leader types.” A head baddy with a retenue of guards is always more difficult to take on.
Is this case, this especially trolly troll takes those two particular options off the table. However, a party of 6-8 PCs can unleash a horrific amount of damage in one round, which is why lonely Head Bad Guy is often anticlimactic.
Old-school take: the thief already reconnoitered the area, blessed party lobs flasks burning oil (2d6+1d6 no save each), arrows and spears, stinking cloud (underrated: BtB save or be “helpless due to naseau” for 2-5 turns), then blind with light or darkness 15′ radius. Fall back, repeat. Thief backstabs once the flames burn out. Regeneration is negated, troll won’t last more than a round or two even if it makes it to HtH although, surely, some PCs are likely to buy it in melee.
However, that’s if combat is joined at all. An important part of a good Old School adventure is an “unscaled” foe that the party does not have to take on at all.
I recall an early OSRIC module that had a lone lich as the head baddy, but the adventure was for levels 12-15 and it was noted that a cleric in that level range could turn Head Bad Guy with a roll of 10. That module could very well end with a whimper. Avoid solo Head Bad Guys!
I’m guessing you run AD&D? Could be wrong, but your post has that feel. I think AD&D players sometimes have more system mastery as well as better tactics than clone OSR players.
But either way, I do broadly agree about one tough opponent. Especially when a leveled party has come up organically in play from level 1, they’ve got some accumulated items, henchmen and tactics they can bring to bear.
On the other hand, do you need to fight the troll? “A troll king, a corrupted human. Who basically talks to you.” Suggests to me it’s not a mandatory combat encounter. Maybe the party get something by talking to it. Maybe they go nova and smack it down, but if the real point of the adventure is the whispers from the chasm then it’s okay if they do or don’t. This part might just be good OSR design.
I like the high points Bryce relates well enough I might even look at this for a highlighter/rewrite job, and I’m normally highly biased against those. Or I might just steal all the good ideas for one of my own dungeons. I run kind of vanilla sometimes when I’ve only rolled one randomly, and spicing it up is absolutely worth my time.
Anytime you can parley with a monster is, in my opinion, good game design.
Preparation and space is certainly a huge issue and I don’t disagree with much you have said. However, the differences between systems count for something. In B/X Web would only slow down the troll for 2 rounds, Hold Person would not work because of the Troll’s size and Stinking Cloud is not allowed in B/X because it would be too cool to have it.
Flasks of oil would be a good bet (1d8 x2 in LL), but you’d want them prepared beforehand. Effective reconnoitering helps a lot.
I’m thinking after I’m done running B2 and maybe a follow up I’ll try AD&D 1e. I’ve been rereading the Phb and Dmg and there is much to love.
It is fiddly and, therefore, fun. My group is actually going in the opposite direction, we have but short spurts of time to game, so we are playing B/X and have learned to stop worrying and love race-as-class.
The hit point scale between B/X and AD&D are VERY different. A 4th level fighter in the latter could have the equivalent of +1 extra hit die (or +2 depending on CON), and ALL characters besides magic-users get this boost.
Most of the monsters, on the other hand (including trolls) stay the same.
Still, everything Gnarley’s saying about single Big Bads generally holds true for both systems…a large enough group can take down a single foe from distance (using arrows or whatnot) and then finish the thing with fire. Low level PCs in numbers need only fear the single monster that requires magic weapons to hit (a gargoyle, for instance).
Dat cover tho . . . Oof.
Yay, another Orcs In A Hole (ok, goblins in a cave) for low levels! Expectations subverted!
The idea about the whispers etc. is great however and deserves to be stolen.
Shit dude. Try to match your stolen witticisms to the actual flaws of the product. Sounds like this one has enough demerits you’ve got a choice, but “orcs in a hole/expectations subverted” has fucking nothing to do with “oracular whispers from a chasm” and the other high points mentioned.