The Heretic
Should be playing D&D instead
So yeah, everyone agrees that 2nd edition sucked, right? Or are there 2nd edition shippers out there that just aren't as visible as the 1e/5e lovers?
Yeah, I suppose that was true. There was a lot of dreck though, like the kits in the complete handbook, or skills and powers, etc.I did like the peripherals for 2e - splatbooks and whatnot. I have a copy of Encyclopedia Magica, and it's cool as shit.
What you talking about Willis? There were good 2e modules? <blink> Oh I suppose there were a few good Planescape ones...Some of the modules were OK too.
NEVERMIND. I must be remembering this wrong or maybe the scholarship on this was poor.* FYI in the other thread you mentioned how weird it was that the bard class had to 'become a druid'. Not exactly. IIRC bards were one of the three types of holy men of the ancient Celts, besides Druids and and....uh, I forget the third one. It was D&D that turned bard into 'minstrel class' and druid into 'nature priest'.
Fan. Cut my teeth on it. By the end there was no recourse but to kill it since it was a splatbookey mess but 2e did a lot of good things. I'd say 2e over 1e. I mean who uses those Weapons vs AC tables *scoff*So yeah, everyone agrees that 2nd edition sucked, right? Or are there 2nd edition shippers out there that just aren't as visible as the 1e/5e lovers?
Planescape modules were wannabe drama stuff with metaplot mostly. Most of Bruce Cordell's modules hold up, as does The Dancing Hut arguably. Monstrous Arcana was good shit.What you talking about Willis? There were good 2e modules? <blink> Oh I suppose there were a few good Planescape ones...
Oh. That's probably why.When 2e came out we more or less blended it with 1e.
I'm curious, what are the names of the modules that are considered to be 'not bad'?I find to be unreadable even those modules that are generally accepted to be not bad. There may be decent content buried in there but I can't get to it.
Bah! Maybe YOU'RE the heretic!Fan. Cut my teeth on it. By the end there was no recourse but to kill it since it was a splatbookey mess but 2e did a lot of good things. I'd say 2e over 1e. I mean who uses those Weapons vs AC tables *scoff*
I suppose Planescape modules were fun to read, but not to try to run. Bruce Cordell, what'd he do? <looks at wikipedia> Return to the Tomb of Horrors, Return to White Plume Mountain? Eh? What would you consider to be the best of Bruce's work?Planescape modules were wannabe drama stuff with metaplot mostly. Most of Bruce Cordell's modules hold up, as does The Dancing Hut arguably. Monstrous Arcana was good shit.
Welll Mallrat, now that you ask...**cracks knuckles**...alright...let's hear it....
Looking over my list of modules, I was thinking about a bunch of post 1985 1e modules. Yeah, I'm not aware of any decent 2e modules, whereas I can think of a few redeemable ones from the 3e and 4e period. EDIT: No, wait, I have heard that Firestorm Peak is decent.I'm curious, what are the names of the modules that are considered to be 'not bad'?
I can think of some pretty awful modules. Ones written for the Forgotten Realms especially (the Horde, some Moonshae crap where every magic item was a special magic item only usable by cultists of Bane/Cyric/whatever, etc)
AHA!! This is going to be good!!!Welll Mallrat, now that you ask...
ahh fuck..*throws up hands and walks away*I suppose it's mostly for non-game related reasons.
I think I have those hex acetates too. The setting itself was a disappointment, mostly. I was expecting a gazetteer like Greyhawk. Not what I got...2e did a great job with settings. I don't really like the core rules much (tho' I certainly played quite a bit of it back when I was young) but I still own things like the cloth map that came in the first Dark Sun boxed map, the hex acetate that came in the FR 2e boxed set, and a bunch of Planescape books that I raid for ideas and images once in a while.
Hmm. Were there any good 1e 1985 modules? I'm trying to remember. Maybe some of the I series or UK series were okay. Which ones were you thinking of?Looking over my list of modules, I was thinking about a bunch of post 1985 1e modules. Yeah, I'm not aware of any decent 2e modules, whereas I can think of a few redeemable ones from the 3e and 4e period. EDIT: No, wait, I have heard that Firestorm Peak is decent.
Well. I was going to bash 2e but I couldn't think of anything bad about the base system itself. Besides the lack of demons and devils. But then that was partially because before I even got to play D&D, an older kid on a Boy Scouts camping trip asked me to look through the Monster Manual II and find some monsters with low ACs and high hit dice for him to use with his game that night. I found the demons and devils and thought 'whoa, awesome!'. I even tried to make some of my own monsters that year, without even knowing what hit dice meant (I improvised, it means what you hit the monster on if you roll a d6). I came up with a robeast, the euryale, the stheno, the zaxxon, and a few other knock-offs. I think I have that folder still, somewhere.AHA!! This is going to be good!!!
ahh fuck..*throws up hands and walks away*
Nah, I hear you. I guess I consider myself more of a 1.5 guy. I played Basic, Expert, 1e, then 2e...never used Option books.
That's cool that 2e opened up your imagination as a player. That works. As for what you're saying about 3e, I understand. I like a lot of what 3e did, but it definitely neutered the DM and made D&D more of a gameNow having said that...I look at 3e and above and suddenly felt overwhelmed with all the feats and stuff I can't even remember. I think it was too much because where 2e I felt I could explore options, suddenly 3e brought in more stuff--but it felt like rules, so it cramped my imagination. If that makes sense...
I was excited for Spelljammer but hated it once I got it. "This isn't space! This is just some weird dreamed up from the essay Gary had in the 1e DMG about your milieu!" I ended up selling it. A few years later I realized that it was actually kind of cool and that I should've kept. I've taken some of ideas from it as I've refined my own, personal campaign setting. Eventually I decided to make my campaign world flat. Of course that's bad if you're playing with physicist-in-training ("how do you have time zones if it's flat" "fine! it's convex. flat but non-euclidean!")People always talk about how good the settings are in 2e. About a month ago, I finally bought Planescape and Spelljammer (still haven't read them yet) just to see what all the hub bub was about. I did like Forgotten Realms as a kid, but sorta over it. Is it weird that I try not to read too much RPG material because I don't want to subconsciously copy something when I publish? But I need something to hopefully blow my mind a little with different dimensions/planes..so took the plunge.
I approve!So I'm not going to put up much of an argument, but my main stance of why I like 2e....that for me at least, it gave me the 'green light' to blow up my imagination and try new shit.
Same. FR2e was mainly useful for me as a kid because it gave me a sense of what should be part of worldbuilding (e.g. a calendar) back near the start of my D&D career, and because of that hex acetate (back when there weren't custom print-shops on every corner). The setting itself left me utterly cold. I did admire how they left Sembia utterly unmapped so you could put your own spin on it, something that sadly they immediately violated in 3e.I think I have those hex acetates too. The setting itself was a disappointment, mostly. I was expecting a gazetteer like Greyhawk. Not what I got...
Well, remember, these are modules I read about in places like Dungeon of Signs and Grognardia but never read myself. Like some of the later modules in the B series, which I couldn't even read. Bloodstone Pass, Journey to the Rock, Night's Dark Terror, Temple of the Frog, that sort of thing.Hmm. Were there any good 1e 1985 modules? I'm trying to remember. Maybe some of the I series or UK series were okay. Which ones were you thinking of?